Religion and politics often make some people lose all perspective and give way to ranting and raving and carrying on like emotional children, they either refuse to discuss it with reason or else they prefer argumentum ad hominem, which is a hell of a way to conduct a discussion… well, anyhow, not long ago, I was talking about the elections and how the campaigns were ignoring the issues, and sticking instead to invective and personal crap that had nothing to do with the substantive problems of running a government (which is all true, as you know if you followed the speeches and so-called debates of the candidates), now anyhow, one of the guys I was talking with said not a word in the whole conversation, except at the end, when he suddenly chuckled and said we were all full of shit and “why didn’t we go live in Russia or China if that was the way we all hated the United States of America?”, next thing you know, the whole blooming discussion was more like a brawl and the epithets flew thick and fast and the noise was incredible, someone said “son of a bitch” and I think he said “bastard!” (I couldn’t be sure; it was all so confusing), well, anyhow, I was attempting to get it all back on a rational level, I tried, for example, to talk to the one who had started it all, and I asked him just what did he mean we were “all full of shit?”, was he making a statement of fact as he knew it and where was his documentation to back up his claim and I think Socrates would have been proud of the way I refuted his argument, of course, that is, I *tried* to refute it, but all he could offer by way of rebuttal was more of the same: about how we were all full of shit, but he wouldn’t say why; he just kept on repeating it and that and the part about Russia and China and communist dupes, and I’ll have to confess that I got a bit angry and told him to stuff his ideas up his ass (which you don’t have to tell me is hardly a way to convince anyone in an arg